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when i was first asked to be in

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on the conference and talk

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i

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a lot of people out there that had

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experienced things and had had memories

6
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of things they didn't understand and

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felt

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uncomfortable with them and i knew that

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the other people who had talked to me

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about it

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and shared their stuff with me helped me

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to feel better about a lot of things so

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i thought i could help somebody else

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then i thought if if what good is it

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going to do me if i hide behind this

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name right

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and it's it's basically you said it's

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their problem this is your story you

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don't have to believe this you're not

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here to sell anything it's just your

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story that's right

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now when we were talking about this you

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still

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and you've been through a lot you you

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referred to these as dreams you still in

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your own mind fight with this experience

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there are

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a lot some parts of it i don't have any

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problem with it's very easy for me to

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say yes i believe that there's got to be

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some other kind of life somewhere else

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and

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nobody can tell me i didn't see it they

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weren't there and i and i know what i

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saw

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if you don't believe me that's that's

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your too bad

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but um

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there are things that i do have problems

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believing you know accepting what what

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what do you have problems with um

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the hardest part for you is

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well the hardest part for me is when i

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got pregnant

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um

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that i was going to marry

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and i still think i did i don't you know

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it's a tug of war inside of me

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and i was just like any other woman that

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got pregnant and then lost a baby it

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hurt all the same

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you know

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but the circumstances under which

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i lost it were unusual to say the least

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and uh

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that's why i kept it to myself for seven

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years after my mother knew that i had

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been pregnant and then wasn't pregnant

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so you're pregnant you're suddenly not

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pregnant and what happened to this child

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was at least your dream recall is

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that you were abducted

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and the child was taken from you

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the day that i woke up

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and the first thing i when i the first

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thing that came to my mind when i woke

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up that morning was i'm not pregnant

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this is after an abduction experience a

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dream experience like

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yeah

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i'm not pregnant and then i got up and

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went to the restroom and there was a

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little bit of spotting but i still

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continued to say i wasn't pregnant i

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also felt that it

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that i had had a baby girl

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and uh

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and in a subsequent abduction

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when you were went through one of these

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dream experiences you were shown a child

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and this child you you recognize but

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it's part human and it's part not human

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it didn't look

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real good

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how old would this child have been when

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you saw

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about three or four

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danny one thing is that uh this is of

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course the most difficult thing for

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debbie or anybody else to talk about

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who's been through these experiences i

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mean you can talk easily about other

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sides of it but obviously this is goes

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to the heart of one's feelings but this

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has happened to a number of other people

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and i recently i mean i'm dealing now

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with dozens of similar cases recently a

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woman who's married to a doctor

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who uh had uh who was pregnant and

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went through three months of pregnancy

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and there was a heartbeat on the

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ultrasound of the embryo the fetus and

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so forth and then one morning uh she had

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a normal period and there was suddenly

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no more um

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no feta she went in and they did a dnc

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and sent everything to pathology and

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there was absolutely no fetal tissue and

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the doctor simply did not know what to

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do about this now this happens to be

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the wife of a doctor

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and she's been bereft although she does

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not want to accept she has asked me to

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tell her that this doesn't didn't have

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anything to do with her other extensive

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ufo experiences as a woman i understand

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debbie i mean women understand i mean i

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you're telling the story i'm thinking of

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my son or my daughter and one

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understands as a woman the tremendous

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loss that that is implied here

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but this experience in your family is

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not only you

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your mom went through this you went

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through this your older sister went

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through this you read this man's first

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book you write to this man and i'm

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putting myself in your position because

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i know that i would be saying to myself

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deeney

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you're crazy you just got to forget this

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because there's something going a little

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wrong you don't want to tell anybody

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because maybe you're just coming apart

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internally right so we'll keep this real

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quiet

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yep and it was reading his book that

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that gave you the

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that little step forward well actually

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wasn't reading his book it was that

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the last episode or whatever you want to

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call it that left a mark in the yard

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i had to live with looking at that thing

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every day and when i did every time i

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did

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i'd

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remember things a lot of the things that

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i remember i didn't need hypnosis to

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remember things that go way back till i

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was really little

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can your objection start at what age

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your dreams started at what age of being

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objective

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the first time i went to detroit and i

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was missing all day and they couldn't

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find me

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i was

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i think that like between six and seven

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and how many times has this happened to

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you now up to present time how many

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experiences have there been

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six or seven

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probably a few more than that actually

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okay now

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now you don't know whether or not this

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is going to happen to you again i mean

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you sit here now

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and you don't you don't know you have to

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live with this that this dream may come

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yep

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this is this is not a comfortable thing

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to have to live with debbie i mean i

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keep trying to put myself in your shoes

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and this would you know

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how do you what do you do for

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reassurance how do you you know how do

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you keep it together debbie how do you

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just keep going here well

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i'm sitting here

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i got all my arms and legs

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i'm alive you know

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and that's okay also uh when we put

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people together with other people in a

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support group who've been through these

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experiences

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and a person can sit there in a room

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full of people who all seem normal and

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happy relatively speaking you feel

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better about yourself you have less

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self-doubt and i think that uh

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debbie's certainly been a a

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wonderful addition to a support group

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that we have in new york and i think

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that's been which would you yeah

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i'm lucky because it involved my entire

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family half of the neighborhood we lived

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in i mean you know it wasn't just me oh

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okay yeah

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it really helps a lot that

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that my family has seen it

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with all the strange stuff debbie's

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actually a very fine artist and did a

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drawing of of the

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person that she had met

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the alien the alien that she had met and

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then on the front of a magazine you saw

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the other drawing

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and you went upstairs and what did you

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do

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threw up

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because it was you thought someone had

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stolen your drawing at first i was angry

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i thought

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how dare them print my drawing without

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asking me i didn't i hadn't given it to

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anyone except bud and even got kind of

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mad at him because i figured he must

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have given it to somebody but then my

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dad pointed out to me the signature at

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the bottom of the drawing and it wasn't

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mine and i didn't know this woman and it

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really scared me now for those of you

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saying oh well look dean you know that's

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just like in the movie close encounters

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of the third kind that's where they all

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got that picture from not so fast

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they did get it from that movie but they

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used your research to make the movie

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that well research of other people uh

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too at the time there was quite a

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collection of drawings very similar to

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these the date from actually back into

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the late 60s and early 70s that dr alan

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heineck handed to spielberg to use for

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his special effects so those figures in